[EM] Poll Ballot, from Richard

Thu Jul 18 05:31:19 PDT 2024

Mmm yes I’m going to be the one “splitting the vote” when Biden wins my
state in a landslide, genius.

On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 5:22 AM Michael Ossipoff <email9648742 at gmail.com>
wrote:

>
> Sorry, I can’t control your voting in November.
>
> You’re going to vote for Biden—or obediently for whomever the DNC says.
>
> Trump will win because you insist on splitting the vote.
>
> …& when Trump wins, don’t forget to congratulate yourself for achieving
> that by your dishonest hold-your-nose sucker voting.
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 02:01 Michael Garman <
> michael.garman at rankthevote.us> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> And how do you intend to make that happen?
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 4:43 AM Michael Ossipoff <email9648742 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> My magic plan is honest voting.
>>>
>>> Not splitting the non-Trump between honest voters & giveaway-sucker
>>> voters.
>>>
>>> Not having a high percentage of us throw their vote away on someone none
>>> of us want.
>>>
>>> Do you see the lunacy of most of the voters holding their nose & voting
>>> for someone that none of us want?
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 01:15 Michael Garman <
>>> michael.garman at rankthevote.us> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What’s your magic plan to make a third party candidate win in 2024? A
>>>> plan that doesn’t rely on unrepresentative Internet alternative method
>>>> polls.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 1:43 AM Michael Ossipoff <
>>>> email9648742 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 22:16 John T Whelan <john.whelan at astro.rit.edu>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Richard gets at the fundamental problem with polls like this: anyone
>>>>>> willing to run for President as a third party candidate in the current
>>>>>> political climate under the current electoral system has shown a lack of
>>>>>> judgement and responsibility which makes them an unacceptable choice.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No, it just means they aren’t lesser-evil suckers.
>>>>>
>>>>> The-Two-Choices are for the suckers who believe whatever ther TV tells
>>>>> them
>>>>>
>>>>> e.g. the bizarre looney belief that two candidates & parties that none
>>>>> of us want could be The-Two-Choices.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, it would be better to have a better electoral system. That’s why
>>>>> we’re all here.
>>>>>
>>>>> But that doesn’t mean we have to continue to be such complete suckers
>>>>> now.
>>>>>
>>>>> Michael Ossipoff
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>> *From:* Election-Methods <
>>>>>> election-methods-bounces at lists.electorama.com> on behalf of Michael
>>>>>> Ossipoff <email9648742 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, July 18, 2024 4:35:20 AM
>>>>>> *To:* Richard, the VoteFair guy <electionmethods at votefair.org>
>>>>>> *Cc:* election-methods at lists.electorama.com <
>>>>>> election-methods at lists.electorama.com>
>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [EM] Poll Ballot, from Richard
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CAUTION: This message from outside RIT could not be authenticated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you do not recognize the email address of the person who sent the
>>>>>> email, do not click on links, open attachments, or repond to the message.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please see article KB0042035 at help.rit.edu or contact the RIT
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 16:55 Richard, the VoteFair guy <
>>>>>> electionmethods at votefair.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Michael, here is my ballot.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you claim you need a full ranking, then I choose not to vote in
>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>> poll.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Richard—
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ballot recorded.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, neither RP(wv), nor RCV, nor STV requires a full ranking. So your
>>>>>> ballot is perfectly technically valid & complete, as-is.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's because I don't have time to research unfamiliar
>>>>>>> candidates and unfamiliar parties.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course, that’s a good reason to vote a short ranking or a
>>>>>> 1-candidate approval.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I & others voted that way in the voting-systems poll.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It would probably be as inappropriate as hell for the poll proposer &
>>>>>> conductor to comment on someone’s ballot.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But surely it would be okay for anyone here to reply to someone
>>>>>> else’s political comments, or evaluations of candidates & parties.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Such discussion is necessary, & there’s an understanding here that
>>>>>> “electioneering” is part of polling…or at least should be permissible. I
>>>>>> believe that it’s more than permissible: Discussion about why we vote as we
>>>>>> do, & the expression of contrary opinions, reactions or choices, are
>>>>>> essential.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But it probably wouldn’t be appropriate in the “official” reply that
>>>>>> acknowledges your ballot.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So I’ll reply in a separate post, immediately after this one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In the candidate poll my ballot is that I rank Biden as the only
>>>>>>> "approved" candidate -- even though I wish he would drop out and
>>>>>>> transfer his delegate votes to nearly anyone.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I rank Trump at the bottom of the candidate list, below all the
>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>> candidates, because he wants to destroy democracy, destroy the U.S.
>>>>>>> economy as a favor to Putin, and destroy the U.S. military as
>>>>>>> another
>>>>>>> favor to Putin.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In between I rank all the other candidates at the same preference
>>>>>>> level,
>>>>>>> and not worth researching to rank them because they lack high-level
>>>>>>> executive experience and expertise.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In the party poll, I rank the Democratic party as the only
>>>>>>> "approved"
>>>>>>> party because it's the only party offering a viable candidate.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Under current circumstances I rank the Republican party at the
>>>>>>> bottom of
>>>>>>> the list, below all other parties.  That's because they are not
>>>>>>> offering
>>>>>>> a candidate who wants to preserve fair elections, protect the U.S.
>>>>>>> against its enemies, and improve the economy.  As another flaw, the
>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>> Republican party platform claims the presidential election will not
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>> fair if the Republican candidate doesn't win the presidential
>>>>>>> election.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In case you didn't notice the above words "only approved party,"
>>>>>>> I'll
>>>>>>> clarify that all the parties other than the Democratic party are
>>>>>>> "unapproved" because they do not offer viable candidates.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Apparently, in this poll, you want me to point to one party as the
>>>>>>> one I
>>>>>>> like.  It's "none of the above."  That's because I dislike all
>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>> U.S. political parties.  Yes, I'm willing to "throw away" this vote
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> express this preference.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Clarification:  I register with either the Republican or Democratic
>>>>>>> party so I can vote in the primary elections of one or the other of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> two parties that supply viable nominees.  I switch between those two
>>>>>>> parties periodically.  I dislike them both.  I also dislike all
>>>>>>> third
>>>>>>> parties.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My dislike of existing political parties is why I promote
>>>>>>> election-method reform!  If U.S. election reforms are well-designed,
>>>>>>> then in the future at least one U.S. party will be motivated to
>>>>>>> offer
>>>>>>> wise problem-solving leaders instead of whatever you want to call
>>>>>>> their
>>>>>>> current nominees.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Richard Fobes
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7/16/2024 9:24 PM, Michael Ossipoff wrote:
>>>>>>> > One reason for my voting 1st is to demonstrate what I mean by the
>>>>>>> > voting-instructions:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> ----
>>>>>>> Election-Methods mailing list - see https://electorama.com/em for
>>>>>>> list info
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----
>>>>> Election-Methods mailing list - see https://electorama.com/em for
>>>>> list info
>>>>>
>>>>
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