[EM] Poll on voting-systems, to inform voters in upcoming enactment-elections

[Michael Ossipoff]

On Thu, Apr 4, 2024 at 11:43 AM Joshua Boehme <joshua.p.boehme at gmail.com>
wrote:

>
> Reading this, my question was: what's the specific question we'd be
> answering?
>
> "How would you rank (or approve) these various voting-systems, in regards
to their merit-in-use (cost & difficulty of implementation, administration
& auditing against count-fraud--& strategy demands or problems for the
voter?"

Obviously we don't all agree on the relative importance of those
considerations for merit-in-use. I value count-fraud-security very highly,
more importantly than the benefits brought by the best ranked-methdos.



> In almost any real world application (i.e., anything other than an
> audience with a very strong math or programming background) I'd personally
> favor Approval over Schulze.


*EXACTLY !!!*

I don't know why I blocked that person a long time ago, but I'm unblocking.


> From a pure theoretical standpoint, though, I'd put them in the opposite
> order


Of course. RP(wv) is my favorite for polls, & for offering to jurisdictions
where people insist on ranked-methods.

> .
>
>
> On 4/4/24 01:13, Michael Ossipoff wrote:
> > EM used to do a lot of polls, but now never does. So I wouldn’t propose
> > one, if it weren’t for the fact that, this year, the voters of at least
> two
> > states are going to vote on whether to enact a certain voting-system.
> >
> > It seems to me—tell me if I’m wrong—that those people have a right to
> know
> > how people familiar with voting-systems feel about the relative merits of
> > some voting-systems.
> >
> > So, though I claim that polls are valuable for demonstrating the
> experience
> > of using the voting systems, & how they work, & what they’ll do—& are
> > therefore useful & worthwhile for their own sake—this poll that I now
> > propose isn’t a poll for its own sake.
> >
> > It is, as I said, proposed for the important practical purpose of letting
> > the voters in the upcoming enactment-elections know how we feel about the
> > relative merits of some voting-systems, including the one that they’re
> > about to vote on the enactment of.
> >
> > The voting-method for the poll:
> >
> > It seems to me that Schulze is the most popular ranked voting-system,
> among
> > the people at EM.
> >
> > …& it seems to me that the last time we voted on EM’s collective favorite
> > voting-system, Approval won.
> >
> > Those seem the top-two, in EM popularity.
> >
> > I prefer RP(wv) to Beatpath, mostly for its simple, intuitively natural &
> > obvious rule, but also for its LIIAC compliance, & the fact that its
> winner
> > usually pairbeats Schulze’s winner.
> >
> > But I guess Schulze is more popular due to its more efficient algorithm.
> >
> > Anyway so I suggest that the poll I propose have a Schulze balloting &
> > count, & an Approval balloting & count.
> >
> > Voting would consist of posting a ranking & an approval-set, in one post.
> >
> > Candidate voting-systems:
> >
> > My purpose isn’t an all-inclusive poll among all proposed voting-systems.
> > …just a very few ones that are the most popular here at EM, solely to
> have
> > a little comparison to the main voting system being publicly voted on
> this
> > year.
> >
> > So it should just be among a few voting-systems. Additionally, no reason
> to
> > make the alternatives-lineup too time-consumingly large by including
> > methods unlikely to win anyway.
> >
> > I’ll suggest a few obvious inclusions. But, of course every poll here
> > should have the possibility of nomination of whatever alternative anyone
> > wants to nominate.
> >
> > I’ll list my nominations in this post, & I claim that those few are all
> the
> > alternatives needed for the poll.  …& anyone can nominate anything
> during a
> > 1-week nomination-period.
> >
> > I suggest the following voting-systems as candidates in the poll, the
> > alternatives among which to vote:
> >
> > Approval
> > RP(wv)
> > Schulze
> > IRV
> >
> > (Schulze & RP are often said to be the ranked-methods most popular among
> > single-winner reform  community, & that seems true at EM.)
> >
> >
> > Is there any need for more alternatives than that?
> >
> > I suggest a nomination period of exactly one week, starting at the time
> > recorded as the posting-time-&-date of this post.
> >
> > After which a voting-period of exactly one month would start…at the exact
> > time as the end of the nomination-period.
> >
> > If there are no nominations (I suggest that none are needed) during the
> > nomination-period—& if, during the nomination-period, no one posts the
> > words “I second the suggestion of a poll”—then of course there’d not be a
> > poll.
> >
> > Again, I realize that polls are no longer popular here, but this is a
> > special situation, bringing a need for voters in the upcoming public
> > enactment-election to have a chance to hear how people at EM feel about
> > relative merit among voting-systems. So let’s make an exception to the
> > absence of polls here, for voters in the next election.
> >
> >
> > ----
> > Election-Methods mailing list - see https://electorama.com/em for list
> info
> ----
> Election-Methods mailing list - see https://electorama.com/em for list
> info
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.electorama.com/pipermail/election-methods-electorama.com/attachments/20240406/070e045b/attachment-0001.htm>