[EM] Retiring from voting systems, quitting EM

[Kevin Venzke]

Hi Robert,


________________________________
 De : robert bristow-johnson <rbj at audioimagination.com>
À : election-methods at lists.electorama.com 
Envoyé le : Mardi 22 juillet 2014 20h17
Objet : Re: [EM] Retiring from voting systems, quitting EM
 

On 7/22/14 7:11 PM, Forest Simmons wrote:
>> Like Chris Benham, Kevin Venzke, and others I owe a lot to Mike Ossipoff.
>>
>> He patiently explained difficult concepts by repeating the same 
>> concepts in different words until reaching the simplest formulation.  
>> This was a tremendous help for me when I didn't see the point of 
>> "winning votes" versus "margins" fourteen years ago (for example).
>
>
>i still don't see the point.  a vote for your guy is +1, a vote for the 
>other guy is -1, and a vote for neither counts for 0.
>
>
>whether is Schulze or Tideman or Kemeny–Young or Simpson-Kramer the 
>disappointment of the losing voter counts as much (but in the other 
>direction) as the satisfaction of the winning voter.  vote margins are 
>the product of the percent decisiveness times the vote turnout.  an 
>pairwise election that's virtually tied with a huge turnout might not be 
>as indicative of voter intent with a slightly lower turnout but a very 
>decisive, creating a larger margin.


Those of us who don't like margins tend to focus on strategic implications 
more than on the philosophy behind it. That said, it bothers me that (given
that there is only one seat to win) many voters won't want their candidates
to win their contests. For example the supporters of a not-really-contending
Far Left candidate get no benefit when a Far Left>Center Left contest

is respected, if the real result is that Center Left>Right is overturned with
the election going to Right.

I would rather look at what happens in the end and what could have happened
if people had voted differently. For example in this case I see that the 
presence of Far Left evidently threw the election to Right, so that next time
Far Left voters might compromise, or the Far Left candidate might decide
(or be pressured) not to run again. Whereas, if Left had simply been elected
in the first place, I don't see anyone who would then wish that they had voted
in some other way.

WV is more to my taste here because the raw "winning votes" you can 
command correlates pretty well with your viability as a candidate. Minor
candidates' wins don't stick, making it safer to vote for them.

Kevin
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