[EM] Primary network effects and national dialogue

[Alexander Praetorius]

yes


On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Michael Allan <mike at zelea.com> wrote:

> Hi Alex,
>
> > It can never be about "eliminating the network effect".  The network
> > effect in itself is one fundamental evolutionary principle.  You
> > cannot circumvent it, you can only try to work WITH it.
>
> Public telephone networks are the classic example.  Bell's network
> dominated for roughly a century in North America because it had more
> subscribers and therefore more people to call.  Small carriers could
> not get subscribers.  That's the network effect.
>
> Today, the subscribers of small carriers in North America can call
> exactly the same number of people as Bell subscribers.  The network
> effect that favoured Bell vs. the smaller carriers has been
> eliminated.  So it's clearly possible to do that.
>
> Mike
>
>
> Alexander Praetorius said:
> > I have one objection so to say.
> >
> > It can never be about "eliminating the network effect".
> > The network effect in itself is one fundamental evolutionary principle.
> > You cannot circumvent it, you can only try to work WITH it.
> >
> > People have to orient themselves somehow and it doesnt matter in what way
> > they do this.
> > It might be through following people, following ideas, following
> > principles, following beliefs, whatever...
> > Once they do that, and they always do in any given point in time there is
> > some guiding or governing "things", it can be abused.
> >
> > So if people follow a person, that person can abuse it. If they follow
> > money, whoever controls money could abuse it. If they follow a product
> > (e.g. a software), the developers could abuse it...
> >
> > All people might realize they are being abused, but how should they alter
> > their behavior? In lack of consensus or the opportunity to sync their
> > behavior, its not an easy task to agree upon THE solution which everyone
> > might use as an alternative.
> > And beside that, this alternative solution, even if people COULD agree to
> > use the alternative (which might take huge efforts) could then again
> start
> > to abuse people....
> >
> > So its a NON TRIVIAL PROBLEM :-)
> >
> > The only thing people can hope for is to choose an alternative which will
> > not abuse them or might make it more difficult to do so.
> >
> > So i think, what is needed is to create a very good alternative, which
> > people start to use, because its better than all the other alternatives,
> > thus it creates traction. Now eventually enough people join and the
> network
> > effect starts to build up, so in order to end the negative effects,
> meaning
> > the potential for abuse through those people which "created the new
> > solution" is, to make sure, that everyone else can join in and can
> > collaborate and change whats there. Its the open source principle, but
> with
> > the twist, that "a fork" does not really fork in a sense that the current
> > version and the forked one loose compatibility, but following certain
> > principles, the compatibility is not broken.
> >
> > I think what it needs is open standards, but not only for data to be
> > interchanged or for protocols to be open, but also open standards (maybe
> > initially created by core developers, but later on agreed upon through
> all
> > the users) about HOW to set up "vote mirroring", not only for votes but
> for
> > every imaginable aspect of the system.
> >
> > Thus, where NO shared underlying standard for stuff exists, there should
> be
> > at least a good method of how people can MAP their approach to another
> > approach, so that their systems can communicate and eventually a standard
> > will evolve.
> >
> > This mindset is the principle for which we would in fact really like to
> > have a NETWORK EFFECT :-) ...please everyone join in to the common cause
> > ;-) this mindset is something i personally would very much like to have a
> > very strong network effect in, so that other mindsets, which are
> exclusive,
> > cannot "survive" so to speak ;-)
> >
> > --
> >
> > Best Regards / Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> > ***********************************************
> > Alexander Praetorius
> > Rappstraße 13
> > D - 60318 Frankfurt am Main
> > Germany
> > *[skype] *alexander.praetorius
> > *[mail] *citizen at serapath.de <alexander.praetorius at serapath.de>
> > *[web] *http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Benutzer:Serapath
> > ***********************************************
> _______________________________________________
> Votorola mailing list
> Votorola at zelea.com
> http://mail.zelea.com/mailman/listinfo/votorola
>



-- 

Best Regards / Mit freundlichen Grüßen
***********************************************
Alexander Praetorius
Rappstraße 13
D - 60318 Frankfurt am Main
Germany
*[skype] *alexander.praetorius
*[mail] *citizen at serapath.de <alexander.praetorius at serapath.de>
*[web] *http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Benutzer:Serapath
***********************************************
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.electorama.com/pipermail/election-methods-electorama.com/attachments/20130418/e8f0c760/attachment-0001.htm>