[EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected

[Kathy Dopp]

I meant back in the days when Arrow came up with his theorem
concerning rank choice votes failing at least one of his fairness
criteria. (IRV fails more of Arrow's fairness criteria than plurality
and fails more of Arrow's criteria than all other alternative methods
I've heard recommended.)

Arrow, Kenneth J. (1951). Social Choice and Individual Values. Wiley,
New York. ISBN 0-300-01364-7.  2nd ed. 1963

Back in 1951, although I see he has republished his book as late as 1963.

Thassal. "spoiler" was not a common word back then. However nowadays
most people think of a spoiler, just like Arrow's fairness criteria
does, as a nonwinning candidate who "spoils" the election by causing a
different candidate (less popular candidate) to win due to his
presence in the election -- just like happened due to using IRV in
Burlington's last mayoral election where Republican voters were fooled
into thinking that their "votes wouldn't be wasted" and that they
could "vote sincerely" and other Fairytales spread by the misnomered
Fair Vote in order to promote IRV which eviscerates the ability of the
public to oversee electoral integrity in addition to eviscerating
voter rights and fairness.

Fairytale Vote has truly been one of the most successful misleaders on
the facts in recent years.

Cheers,

Kathy



On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 10:46 AM, Jonathan Lundell <jlundell at pobox.com> wrote:
> On Jan 22, 2010, at 5:32 AM, Kathy Dopp wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 12:55 AM, Jonathan Lundell <jlundell at pobox.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Arrow never used, never mind defined, the word "spoiler".
>>>
>>
>>
>> That is true. Back in Arrow's day,
>
> "Back in Arrow's day"? Like, um, today?
>
>> the word spoiler was not used, but
>> Arrow exactly and broadly describes the spoiler condition as one of
>> his fairness criteria.
>
> Arrow defines IIA precisely.
>
> "Spoiler", on the other hand, is a word in casual English defined, as are most such words, by its usage, which is generally a candidate with little or no chance of winning who affects the outcome negatively relative to their supporters' preferences--a restricted, somewhat fuzzy, subset of IIA violations.
>
>
>> Study this to understand and was easy to find
>> using google on "Arrow's Fairness Criteria"
>>
>> http://www.ctl.ua.edu/math103/Voting/whatdowe.htm#The%20Independence%20of%20Irrelevant%20Alternatives%20Criterion
>>
>> This reminds me of one of the plethora of other deliberately
>> misleading claims of Fairytale Vote
>
> Stop. You're killing me.
>
>> , they constantly cite Arrow's
>> theorem as if that is a logical reason to support IRV when IRV fails
>> more of Arrow's Fairness criteria than even plurality voting does
>> because IRV fails the nonmonotoncity criteria in addition to the
>> spoiler criteria described above which both IRV and plurality fail.
>>
>> Fairytale Vote might be able to fool some of the people all the time,
>> but cannot fool all of the people all of the time like it would like
>> to.  Fairytale Vote redefines the spoiler condition to be only
>> spoilers (nonwinning candidates whose presence in the election change
>> who would otherwise win) who have small support among voters --
>> another very clever trick on their part to mislead the public into
>> thinking that IRV is an improvement over plurality, even though it is
>> much much worse and deprives voters of fundamental fairness and voting
>> rights and eviscerates the ability of the public to oversee the
>> integrity and accuracy of election outcomes.
>
>
>



-- 

Kathy Dopp

Town of Colonie, NY 12304
phone 518-952-4030
cell 518-505-0220

http://utahcountvotes.org
http://electionmathematics.org
http://kathydopp.com/serendipity/

Realities Mar Instant Runoff Voting
http://electionmathematics.org/ucvAnalysis/US/RCV-IRV/InstantRunoffVotingFlaws.pdf

Voters Have Reason to Worry
http://utahcountvotes.org/UT/UtahCountVotes-ThadHall-Response.pdf

Checking election outcome accuracy --- Post-election audit sampling
http://electionmathematics.org/em-audits/US/PEAuditSamplingMethods.pdf