[Election-Methods] [english 95%] Re: [english 94%] Re: method design challenge +new method AMP

[Juho]

On May 9, 2008, at 13:39 , Jobst Heitzig wrote:

> Dear Juho,
>
> you wrote:
>
>> (Roughly the question is if one wants to
>> give Stalin and other unwanted fellows a small probability to become
>> elected or a zero probability.)
>
> I don't think this is the point. To the contrary, bringing up such  
> examples is quite misleading, I think, because extreme options are  
> not at all a problem of non-deterministic methods only.

Yes, but as I see it the reasons are different. In a typical non- 
deterministic method like random ballot I think it is the intention  
to give all candidates with some support also some probability of  
becoming elected. In the deterministic methods electing some non- 
popular extremist is typically an unwanted feature and a result of  
the method somehow failing to elect the best winner.

> *No* election or decision method should be applied without first  
> checking the feasibility of options with respect to certain basic  
> requirements. This sorting out the "constitutional" options cannot  
> be subject to a group decision process itself since often the  
> "unconstitutional" options have broad support (Hitler is only the  
> most extreme example for this).
>
> In other words, without such a feasibility check *before* deciding,  
> also majoritarian methods can produce a very bad outcome (think of  
> Rwanda...).

Ok, this looks like an intermediate method where one first has one  
method (phase 1) that selects a set of acceptable candidates and then  
uses some other method (phase 2) (maybe non-deterministic) to elect  
the winner from that set.

There is need for pure non-deterministic methods like random ballot,  
and pure deterministic methods, and also combinations of different  
methods may be useful.

Also in the case where the no-good candidates are first eliminated I  
see the same two different philosophies on how the remaining  
candidates are handled. Either all remaining candidates (with some  
support) are given some probability or alternatively one always tries  
to elect the best winner. The intention was thus not to say non- 
deterministic methods would not work properly but that there are two  
philosophies that are quite different and that may be used in  
different elections depending on the nature of the election.

Due to this difference I'm interested in finding both deterministic  
and non-deterministic solutions for the challenge.

Juho

>
> Yours, Jobst
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