[EM] To Markus, re: sincere voting definition

MIKE OSSIPOFF nkklrp at hotmail.com
Mon Jan 14 22:19:19 PST 2002

I'd said:

>OK, but though Random Candidate can be called a choice method,
>it can't be called a voting system.

Markus replied:

When you want to prove an impossibility theorem, then of course
you must not only consider all those methods you consider acceptable,
you must also exclude (by using appropriate axioms) those methods
you don't consider acceptable.

Otherwise, somebody would use Random Candidate or Random Dictatorship
as examples that your impossibility theorem is false.

I reply:

Sure, and if Random Ballot really passes IIAC, as defined in your posting, 
then, as you
said, it can't truly be said that no voting system passes it. I'm not 
agreeing yet that
RC passes your IIAC, because I haven't rechecked and printed-out your 
definition yet,
but maybe it does.

But Random Candidate still isn't a voting system.

Markus continues:

So you say that when someone exaggerates his opinion under average rating
then this is still "sincere voting" as long as the casted _order_ of the
candidates' ratings reflects the sincere opinion of this voter?

I reply:

Yes, because, when, with that definition, or criteria that use it,  I refer 
to "sincere voting",
I mean voting that's sincere & complete as regards order (who's voted over 

You know, there's some justification for that, aside from laziness. It's 
more definite
if you prefer Smith to Jones than what numerical ratings you'd give to Smith 
& to Jones.
So you could say that my definition deals only with what's most obvious & 
definite about
how someone regards the candidates.

So far that simplified definition seems to work fine. Of course it would be 
to have one that required CR voters to rate sincerely, a definition that 
isn't obviously
written to cover the special case of CR, and which isn't unusably long or 

So I'd have no objection to such a definition, and if you'd write one, that 
be a good thing.

Markus continues:

How do you define "sincere voting" for cumulative voting?

I reply:

I use that same definition for all methods.

Of course if that definition acts contrary to what we'd expect when applied 
to Cumulative,
I'd like to find out. If it does, post an example.

Mike Ossipoff

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