Re:[EM] Settle for how much less?

[Alex Small]

Mike Ossipoff wrote:

>Wouldn't you agree that if IRV gets adoped, voters will then
>be reluctant to replace it for a long time?

Good point.  As I think more about it, if third parties are shut out with
IRV the public will perceive that the fault, dear Brutus, lies not in our
election methods but in our third parties.  Those wanting more reforms
might be called sore losers who just want to change the rules until they
win.

The IRV initiative dilemma:  If it loses many people will conclude that
the public doesn't want election reform.  If it passes we'll be stuck
with a second-rate reform (or a step backwards, depending on one's view)
and little chance for improvement.  Where's King Solomon when you need
him?

>IRV will only help the Libertarians so far, as you know.  When they
>become a threat to the Republicans, those preferring Libertarian
>candidates will often return to insincerely voting the Republican in 1st
>place--if they ever stop doing so under IRV.

First, I'm a libertarian with a small l, meaning I go in their direction,
but not all the way.  When comparing AV and IRV I suggested that a centrist
party that tends to be socially liberal and fiscally conservative would do
OK under IRV or AV, but better under AV.  The relationship between such a
party and the LP would be like the relationship between the Democrats and
the Greens.  Jesse Ventura is an example of the party that I envision.

Second, this libertarian actually thinks the Dems are the lesser evil.
The left just wants to tax people, the right wants to arrest them.  But
now I'm getting off-topic.....

Question:  Does anybody know if Australia's third parties try a centrist
strategy (some of each side, like the party I envision) or if they are
extreme (being more liberal than the liberal major party, or
more conservative than the conservative major party)?  I realize that they
have only two parties in power, but there must be aspiring contenders
there, just as we have aspiring contenders.  The answer would go a long way
toward solidifying my position on whether IRV is a tiny step forward or a
big step backward.

Alex Small