<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Hi—I definitely agree with this! It's a very problematic misnomer. If I could press a button that deleted the term "Ranked-choice voting" from English and replaced it with "Instant-runoff voting", I 100% would.<div><br></div><div>However, the issue is that's not the choice we have available. When Wikipedia chooses a title, the most important effect this has is on Google and Wikipedia searches for that term. Usually, the top result for "XYZ" on Google is the Wikipedia article titled "XYZ". That's not the case for "Ranked-choice voting", because there isn't a Wikipedia article titled "Ranked-choice voting". Instead, the top result is FairVote's website, which defines RCV as a synonym for IRV in the first line, then provides zero indication that other ranked voting systems exist.</div><div><br></div><div>To be clear—just because the title says "Ranked-choice voting" doesn't mean we can't (or shouldn't) mostly use the term "Instant-runoff voting" in the text (which I actually slightly prefer). The question is, do we want people who google "RCV" to read a page written by FairVote? Or do we want them reading a Wikipedia article that clearly explains how what FairVote and most people call RCV is only one kind of ranked voting, and one that's faced substantial criticism from experts for its properties?</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Oct 21, 2024 at 7:19 AM Joseph Malkevitch <<a href="mailto:jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu">jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="msg2386983618930163015">
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Whatever its faults, Google Scholar gives very focused information to scholarly articles about elections and voting when compared with the "general" Google search engine.</div>
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For me the problem with the use of the name RCV, ranked choice voting, is that it suggests that a ballot which allows the voter to "rank" choices is used but offers no clue about what decision procedure is used to get a "winner" based on the ballots. To model
voting one needs to specify a ballot type and specify a "decision" method. Work of Arrow and other scholars chart what desirable and undesirable features different systems obey.</div>
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Regards,</div>
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Joe</div>
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<div id="m_2386983618930163015divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b>From:</b> Closed Limelike Curves <<a href="mailto:closed.limelike.curves@gmail.com" target="_blank">closed.limelike.curves@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, October 20, 2024 2:54 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Joseph Malkevitch <<a href="mailto:jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu" target="_blank">jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> EM <<a href="mailto:election-methods@lists.electorama.com" target="_blank">election-methods@lists.electorama.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [EM] "Instant-runoff voting" article renamed to "Ranked-choice voting" on English Wikipedia</span>
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<div style="direction:ltr">Google page counts are often off by orders of magnitude, unfortunately.</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">But I'm also not saying no academics use the term IRV, just that, in recent years, "RCV" is definitely dominant.</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">On Fri, Oct 18, 2024 at 2:13 PM Joseph Malkevitch <<a href="mailto:jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu" id="m_2386983618930163015OWA904019d3-d621-721e-e49d-e07845029d40" target="_blank">jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu</a>> wrote:</div>
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For amusement, a few minutes ago I entered the string</div>
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IRV voting</div>
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into</div>
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Google Scholar</div>
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And it claimed to find "about" 14500 citations.</div>
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Regards,</div>
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Joe</div>
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——————————————</div>
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Joseph Malkevitch</div>
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Email:</div>
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<a href="mailto:jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu" id="m_2386983618930163015OWA626feda1-428e-ffb3-529b-b750e69d368a" target="_blank">jmalkevitch@york.cuny.edu</a></div>
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Web page:</div>
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<a href="http://york.cuny.edu/~malk/" id="m_2386983618930163015OWA65d98de5-ed2a-d13c-aafa-0c61f88e046e" target="_blank">http://york.cuny.edu/~malk/</a></div>
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<div id="m_2386983618930163015x_m_2322503375770389503m_-7922245024089897693divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b>From:</b> Election-Methods <<a href="mailto:election-methods-bounces@lists.electorama.com" id="m_2386983618930163015OWA9af3269b-d429-9b3f-8b0c-ae9913869e4d" target="_blank">election-methods-bounces@lists.electorama.com</a>>
on behalf of Closed Limelike Curves <<a href="mailto:closed.limelike.curves@gmail.com" id="m_2386983618930163015OWA497bff3c-a77f-f8d2-2035-39e59cc6aea9" target="_blank">closed.limelike.curves@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 18, 2024 4:12 PM</span></div>
<div id="m_2386983618930163015x_m_2322503375770389503m_-7922245024089897693divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
<b>To:</b> Kristofer Munsterhjelm <<a href="mailto:km-elmet@munsterhjelm.no" id="m_2386983618930163015OWAffeea792-497a-8dd5-cec1-2bd511872586" target="_blank">km-elmet@munsterhjelm.no</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Chris Benham <<a href="mailto:cbenhamau@yahoo.com.au" id="m_2386983618930163015OWAbdac8b85-64ea-d7a8-fb89-8a85fe7be09f" target="_blank">cbenhamau@yahoo.com.au</a>>;
<a href="mailto:election-methods@lists.electorama.com" id="m_2386983618930163015OWA3c8415a5-30ed-b0b3-8c75-5daeb9bce416" target="_blank">
election-methods@lists.electorama.com</a> <<a href="mailto:election-methods@lists.electorama.com" id="m_2386983618930163015OWAf86978e0-89e0-6179-3736-3530fd7b38d7" target="_blank">election-methods@lists.electorama.com</a>>; Rob Lanphier <<a href="mailto:roblan@gmail.com" id="m_2386983618930163015OWAd9506f86-028c-f62b-edd3-73276228502b" target="_blank">roblan@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [EM] "Instant-runoff voting" article renamed to "Ranked-choice voting" on English Wikipedia</span>
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<div style="direction:ltr;font-family:Calibri;color:black">This email originated from
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<div style="direction:ltr">But, in any case, my main comments on this are that Wikipedia policy is actually very clear on this issue.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">1. Wikipedia requires using the common name for a thing, even if it's a misnomer or less-than-ideal. For example, the articles are titled "morning sickness" and "Panama hat" instead of "Nausea and vomiting of pregnancy" or "That
hat from Ecuador sometimes called a Panama hat". This helps both with search results and with ensuring neutrality in naming disputes: the San Francisco Board of Elections would argue "RCV" is accurate because voters do rank the candidates, but that "IRV" is
inaccurate because the results aren't instantly available. </div>
<div style="direction:ltr">2. Wikipedia requires following the lead of a majority of reliable sources. Overwhelmingly, reliable sources (e.g. media, academic papers, and so on) use and explicitly define RCV to mean IRV, not ranked voting methods in general.</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">On Fri, Oct 18, 2024 at 10:05 AM Closed Limelike Curves <<a href="mailto:closed.limelike.curves@gmail.com" id="m_2386983618930163015x_m_2322503375770389503m_-7922245024089897693OWA3fc012dd-71f9-6919-c5f1-a9052d541509" target="_blank">closed.limelike.curves@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">The Electowiki article covers this. The name IRV is a promotional name pushed by FairVote in the early 2000s. The name never really caught on and was never used by anyone but FairVote and Wikipedia, because the first place to adopt
it (San Francisco) renamed it "Ranked-choice voting" because they thought the name IRV would confuse people into expecting the results to be released "instantly" (immediately after polls closed). The term IRV has never seen much widespread use outside voting
theory circles and FairVote.</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">On Fri, Oct 18, 2024 at 9:09 AM Kristofer Munsterhjelm <<a href="mailto:km-elmet@munsterhjelm.no" id="m_2386983618930163015x_m_2322503375770389503m_-7922245024089897693OWA62538a51-bf98-0111-7d7b-d4c6407e8fc2" target="_blank">km-elmet@munsterhjelm.no</a>>
wrote:</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">On 2024-10-18 17:38, Chris Benham wrote:<br>
><br>
> I gather that "Instant Runoff Voting" was originally a promotional name<br>
> in the US that after being used for a long time was changed (for some<br>
> reason I forget) to Ranked Choice Voting.<br>
<br>
From what I understand, one of the public-facing organizations (might<br>
have been the LWV) suggested the name because, to the voter, the<br>
characteristic feature is that you rank the candidates. And then<br>
FairVote found out that it helped their advocacy, so it stuck.<br>
<br>
-km<br>
----<br>
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