<div dir="ltr">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">I hope it’s okay to post, as a
separate thread, some comments that I made in a discussion-reply.<span> </span>…so that the comments will get noticed more,
by having their own thread-title.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">I’d intended this as “electioneering”,
but now I’m a bit late for that.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Yes, many want the method to do
everything for us. In fact I agree with RBJ that, for an inimical electorate
(like our public political elections), the completely legalistic pairwise-count
rank-methods (Condorcet) would be best…all else being equal, as you said.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">But all else is *not* equal !<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Count-fraud is a problem.
Condorcet’s humungously computation-intensive count ridiculously facilitates
count-fraud.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">You want to do a handcount-audit of
a Condorcet count?<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Additionally, the count-program
itself is easier to hide or add fraud-code in.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">As a general principle, then yes
it’s much better to have the voters do it for themselves rather than having a
complicated fraud-prone automatic-machine do everything for them.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">A simple, reliable hand-tool is much
better.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">I’d much rather trust the voters to
use the simple reliable hand-tool (Approval) well, than trust everyone responsible
for the count to not perpetrate count-fraud.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">I’m glad you brought up the desire
for the method to do it all for us (as Condorcet does)…taking our sincere
rankings as input, & outputting the legalistic right choice. …because I’ve
been meaning to address that matter.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…& that’s not even counting the
much less expensive implementation (could be zero cost, without even needing new
count-software), easier less expensive administration, & easier simpler
explanation with consequent easier enactment.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Approval isn’t as difficult to vote
as it opponents claim. There are many ways to choose what or whom to
approve. That variety is a good thing, because you can choose how you like.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Condorcet is legalistic, but we
don’t have to be legalistic! Approval guarantees election of the candidate who
maximizes the number of voters for whom the outcome is in their preferred of
the two merit-subsets, however the voter designates them.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">e.g. If people approve what they
like, Approval maximizes the number of people who like the outcome.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">If people approve what’s acceptable,
then Approval maximizes the number of people for whom the outcome is
acceptable.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">If people approve above expectation,
then Approval maximizes the number of people for whom the outcome is above
expectation…maximizes the number of people pleasantly surprised.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">You don’t know the
objectively-optimal vote? Neither does anyone else, so don’t worry about it!<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Probability, & therefore
expectation & it’s optimization, depends on your available information.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Approving above your subjective
perception of expectation genuinely maximizes your expectation.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Ways of maximizing your expectation:<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Approve everyone you’d appoint
instead of holding the election. Or approve everyone whose election wouldn’t
disappoint you.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">The polling CW is a good estimate of
election-expectation. Approve hir & everyone better.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">If you perceive 2 likely
frontrunners, approve the better one & everyone better. (…but don’t believe
the bullshit that the Democrat & the Republican are the 2 choices).<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">If all were acceptable, then I’d
just approve whom I like. If it were a public-political election, I might try
Better-Than-Expectation before that.<span>
</span>…otherwise, after. If I like them all, & there aren’t the
appearances that inform about expectation, then I’d approve above mean, if I
perceived the mean. But do we perceive the mean? If not, maybe I’d approve the
best half of them (Above-Median), or above the biggest merit-gap.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Above in this post, I described some
0-info strategies, & ways of judging where the election’s expectation is.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Summary:<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Approve all the Acceptables & no
Unacceptables<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Or, if all are acceptable, approve
the ones you like. Of course that maximizes the probability of electing someone
you like<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">If you like them all, approve above
expectation. (If it’s a public-election, maybe try expectation before “Liked”.)<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…with expectation judged by whom you’d
appoint instead of holding the election, or by whose election wouldn’t disappoint
you. …or by taking the polls’ <span> </span>CW as the
expectation. Best-Frontrunner-&-Better can be regarded as one of the ways
of judging expectation & approving by it.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">If there aren’t the appearances
needed for judging expectation, then use one of the remaining 0-info methods,
such as:<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;line-height:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">Above-Mean<span></span></span></p>
<span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"">…</span>
</div>