<div dir="ltr">I have not subscribed to you</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, May 12, 2021 at 2:02 PM <<a href="mailto:election-methods-request@lists.electorama.com">election-methods-request@lists.electorama.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Send Election-Methods mailing list submissions to<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
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1. "Strategy with RCV" on reddit (Rob Lanphier)<br>
2. Re: "Strategy with RCV" on reddit (Kristofer Munsterhjelm)<br>
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Message: 1<br>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2021 16:39:59 -0700<br>
From: Rob Lanphier <<a href="mailto:roblan@gmail.com" target="_blank">roblan@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: <a href="mailto:election-methods@lists.electorama.com" target="_blank">election-methods@lists.electorama.com</a><br>
Subject: [EM] "Strategy with RCV" on reddit<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<CAK9hOY=<a href="mailto:3aQnqUEHyPsux0r8krW8LeG_0-xWD8m9McvySiBY0bA@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank">3aQnqUEHyPsux0r8krW8LeG_0-xWD8m9McvySiBY0bA@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
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Hi folks,<br>
<br>
Interesting proposed strategy for RCV posted on reddit here:<br>
<a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/EndFPTP/comments/n7wqxa/strategy_with_rcv/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.reddit.com/r/EndFPTP/comments/n7wqxa/strategy_with_rcv/</a><br>
<br>
Those of y'all that have reddit accounts should just post your<br>
response there rather than replying here. I have some thoughts<br>
swirling about the 2018 mayoral race here in San Francisco, but I<br>
haven't done a full analysis of THAT election yet. I'm curious how<br>
similar I'm going to find SF 2018 to what /u/After-Season9338<br>
<br>
Rob<br>
<br>
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<br>
Message: 2<br>
Date: Wed, 12 May 2021 11:49:56 +0200<br>
From: Kristofer Munsterhjelm <<a href="mailto:km_elmet@t-online.de" target="_blank">km_elmet@t-online.de</a>><br>
To: Rob Lanphier <<a href="mailto:roblan@gmail.com" target="_blank">roblan@gmail.com</a>>,<br>
<a href="mailto:election-methods@lists.electorama.com" target="_blank">election-methods@lists.electorama.com</a><br>
Subject: Re: [EM] "Strategy with RCV" on reddit<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:67a5a77c-5627-6b91-1d50-62aac624ae5c@t-online.de" target="_blank">67a5a77c-5627-6b91-1d50-62aac624ae5c@t-online.de</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8<br>
<br>
On 12/05/2021 01.39, Rob Lanphier wrote:<br>
> Hi folks,<br>
> <br>
> Interesting proposed strategy for RCV posted on reddit here:<br>
> <a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/EndFPTP/comments/n7wqxa/strategy_with_rcv/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.reddit.com/r/EndFPTP/comments/n7wqxa/strategy_with_rcv/</a><br>
<br>
As I understand it, the strategy is that the Republicans support a<br>
further-left party (the Greens) so as to engineer a center squeeze<br>
against the Democrats.<br>
<br>
But given that the republicans' sincere ranking presumably is R>D>G, it<br>
doesn't seem like they gain anything by doing so, since getting the<br>
Greens elected instead of the Democrats would be a worse outcome.<br>
<br>
Maybe it could be used to discredit IRV and return to FPTP. That could<br>
be an interesting perspective: any voting method where enough voters can<br>
be convinced to vote against their honest preferences, and which then<br>
results in a seemingly incomprehensible or bad outcome, would be<br>
vulnerable to such an attack.<br>
<br>
For instance, an Approval election could be attacked by splitting a<br>
party into a better and worse party, and then through duplicitous<br>
"advice", engineering a Burr failure.<br>
<br>
However, there's a kind of tension. If the bad outcome is obviously bad,<br>
it's going to be hard to get the voters to go along with the unwitting<br>
sabotage. On the other hand, if the bad outcome is not obviously bad,<br>
the voters might not get sufficiently angry to repeal the method.<br>
<br>
The concept of an attack on the legitimacy of the method itself is an<br>
interesting one, though. The more advanced early EM criteria (SFC, SDSC,<br>
immunity to majority complaints, etc.) might help defend against such<br>
attacks.<br>
<br>
> Those of y'all that have reddit accounts should just post your<br>
> response there rather than replying here.<br>
<br>
I used to be on Reddit, but I didn't like what it was turning me into,<br>
so I've taken a break :-)<br>
<br>
-km<br>
<br>
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End of Election-Methods Digest, Vol 202, Issue 4<br>
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