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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Wrapping my brain around it now, sorry if I am slow on the uptake, will post later. </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D;mso-ligatures:standard'>-Benn Grant<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D;mso-ligatures:standard'>eFix Computer Consulting<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D;mso-ligatures:standard'><a href="mailto:benn@4efix.com"><span style='color:#0563C1'>benn@4efix.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D;mso-ligatures:standard'>603.283.6601<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> Jameson Quinn [mailto:jameson.quinn@gmail.com] <br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 17, 2013 1:25 PM<br><b>To:</b> Benjamin Grant<br><b>Cc:</b> EM<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: Participation Criteria and Bucklin - perhaps they *can* work together after all?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Previously we had:<br> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.5in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>49: X:1st Y:4th<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.5in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>50: X:5th Y:4th<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>Y wins.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>Now we add two votes:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.5in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>2: X:3rd Y:2nd<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>X wins.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>So to make a ranked example:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>49: XpqYrstuabcdef<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>49: XutYsrpqfedcba<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>50: abcYXdefpqrstu<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>50: fedYXcbautsrpq<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Add 4 votes:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>4: aXYbcdefpqrstu<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Now I added 12 candidates there, but I'm sure with a little work I could get it down to somewhere in the range of just 4-8 extra candidates. But the point is made.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Jameson<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>2013/6/17 Benjamin Grant <<a href="mailto:benn@4efix.com" target="_blank">benn@4efix.com</a>><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> Jameson Quinn [mailto:<a href="mailto:jameson.quinn@gmail.com" target="_blank">jameson.quinn@gmail.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 17, 2013 12:15 PM<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: Participation Criteria and Bucklin - perhaps they *can* work together after all?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'>2013/6/17 Benjamin Grant <<a href="mailto:benn@4efix.com" target="_blank">benn@4efix.com</a>><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>is because we are letting people skip grades/places. Or to put another way, if we asked the voters under Bucklin to fill out each ballot more strictly, ranking 1st through Nth where there are N candidates – I know that several do not like this approach, *<b>but</b>* my question is this – does *<b>strictly ranked</b>* Bucklin fail Participation??</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'>Yes. Just add 500 other candidates, and fill in the gaps with randomly-selected candidates from the 500. Obviously, you could probably get by with a lot less than 500 — at a rough guess, I'd expect that 8 would be plenty without changing the numbers here, and probably around 4-6 would be enough to make a similar example with smaller gaps work, but my point is that with enough extra candidates who cluster at the bottom of most ballots, you can turn any rated scenario into a ranked scenario.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'>You are being tempted by a mirage here. The first lesson of "voting school kindergarten" is that most problems don't have a perfect solution. That doesn't mean you stop looking for ways to improve things, but it does mean that when you imagine a "fix", you do your best to shoot holes in your own idea. 95% of the time you'll succeed, but the other 5% still makes it worth it.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in'>Jameson<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Oh. That’s disappointing. I have to see it with my own eyes, although I am sure you know what you are talking about, my brain won’t let me move on until I see the disproof. So I will try to create one – a situation where in using strictly ranked Bucklin, adding a new ballot in which A is ranked higher than B, this new ballot somehow switches the winner from A to B.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The challenge is that its intuitively seems like such an impossible task, I am worried that should such an example be possible (and you say it is, and I believe you) I might never find it in my blind spot!</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>So if anyone *<b>has</b>* a handy example of this, I would be grateful for it being brought to my attention, otherwise, I am going to have to try to create it on my own in my own blind spot.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks. </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>-Benn Grant</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>eFix Computer Consulting</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><a href="mailto:benn@4efix.com" target="_blank"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#0563C1'>benn@4efix.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>603.283.6601</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>