<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div>On Jul 7, 2011, at 7:40 PM, Bob Richard wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"> <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">It turns that real live voters (including real live politicians) care a lot about the later</font>-no-harm criterion, even if they don't know what it's called.</div></blockquote><div><br></div>They need to learn that Condorcet offers less painful response than what IRV is offering.<br><blockquote type="cite"><div text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"><br></div></blockquote>Dave Ketchum<br><blockquote type="cite"><div text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> <br> --Bob Richard<br> <br> On 7/7/2011 3:43 PM, Juho Laatu wrote: <blockquote cite="mid:3B6FE471-E5E4-40E6-A3E9-B09220A69E7B@yahoo.co.uk" type="cite"> <pre wrap="">I actually already touched this question in another mail. And the argument was that (in two-party countries) IRV is not as risky risky from the two leading parties' point of view as methods that are more "compromise candidate oriented" (instead of being "first preference oriented"). I think that is one reason, but it is hard to estimate how important.
Juho
On 7.7.2011, at 23.56, Jameson Quinn wrote:
</pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">Russ's message about simplicity is well-taken. But the most successful voting reform is IRV - which is far from being the simplest reform. Why has IRV been successful?
I want to leave this as an open question for others before I try to answer it myself. The one answer which wouldn't be useful would be "Because CVD (now FairVote) was looking for a single-winner version of STV". There's a bit of truth there, but it's a long way from the whole truth, and we want to find lessons we can learn from moving forward, not useless historical accidents.
JQ</pre></blockquote></blockquote></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"><blockquote cite="mid:3B6FE471-E5E4-40E6-A3E9-B09220A69E7B@yahoo.co.uk" type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap=""><span class="Apple-style-span" style="white-space: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: -1; ">-- </span></pre></blockquote></blockquote><pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Bob Richard
Executive Vice President
Californians for Electoral Reform
PO Box 235
Kentfield, CA 94914-0235
415-256-9393
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.cfer.org">http://www.cfer.org</a></pre></div></blockquote></div></body></html>