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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">Paul K wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> Steve Eppley wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">-snip-</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">>> Aren't all the voting methods we've been promoting </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">>> both anonymous and neutral? Doesn't that mean</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">>> none of them are entirely non-random?</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> No. </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> If "none of them are non-random" then all of them are random.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> That's definitely not true. And the there is no connection </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">> between</span></font><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt"> "anonymous"
and "neutral" (whatever that means). </span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">Anonymity means each voter is treated alike. Neutrality
means each candidate is treated alike. (You can find
clearer definitions in the em archive and in the </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">social choice literature.)</span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">These are two criteria that the public is unlikely</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">to be willing to discard.</span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">> There's only a few of the ones discussed on the list that </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">> have a</span></font><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt"> random
component. The suggestion that "none are</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">> non-random" is the</span></font><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">
same as "all are random". It would</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">> suffice to demonstrate the "randomness" of any Condorcet</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">> </span></font><font face="Courier New" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-size:12pt">method, or of
IRV, to support the claim that "all methods</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">> we discuss are random." </span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">Okay, I'll repeat the example I wrote that Paul neglected:</span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt"> 50%: A > B</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt"> 50%: B > A</span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">Pick any of the single-winner methods we've been
considering. How does it decide which _one_ candidate, </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">A or B, to elect? IRV and Borda and the Condorcetian </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">methods must appeal to chance (as a tiebreaker)</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Courier New"><span style="font-size:12pt">if they are to be anonymous and neutral.</span></font></div>
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<div align="left"><font face="Courier"><span style="font-size:12pt">-- Steve</span></font></div>
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