<html><head></head><body>Markus Schulze wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:3B02EF5C.E77A829F@sol.physik.tu-berlin.de"><pre wrap="">It doesn't make much sense to criticize IRV for violating the<br>consistency criterion and then to promote Condorcet methods and<br>to say that a violation of the consistency criterion is not a<br>problem when the used election method meets the Condorcet criterion.</pre>
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I think Forrest is right; consistency violations in IRV are going to be<br>
more severe than in Condorcet. This is because the consistency violations<br>
in IRV are the result of elimination of candidates who have a majority<br>
preference over the actual winner. In Condorcet, they simply result<br>
from non-transitive majority wins, which are fact of life in ranked<br>
elections. IRV is actually creating inconsistencies where none need<br>
be; Condorcet is merely getting trapped by pre-existing ambiguities.<br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:3B02EF5C.E77A829F@sol.physik.tu-berlin.de"><pre wrap="">And it doesn't make much sense to criticize IRV for violating<br>reversal symmetry and then to promote a Condorcet method that<br>violates reversal symmetry and to say that a violation of reversal<br>symmetry is not a problem when the used election method meets the<br>Condorcet criterion. As Blake Cretney wrote to Mike Ossipoff<br>(16 Apr 2001):<br><br></pre>
<blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">You must admit that if you rail against IRV's non-monotonicity,<br>and then propose a method that is non-monotonic, you're going to<br>run into some rhetorical problems.</pre></blockquote>
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I should point out that rhetoric and logic are quite different things. Of<br>
course, rhetoric seems to stick in the minds of most people more than<br>
logic does. But that doesn't mean that a persuasive rhetorical argument<br>
is always valid.<br>
<br>
Richard<br>
<br>
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