[EM] Helping the Pirate Party to vanish

Richard Fobes ElectionMethods at VoteFair.org
Sun Mar 17 09:54:46 PDT 2013

On 3/15/2013 1:27 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote:
> At 04:16 AM 3/14/2013, Kristofer Munsterhjelm wrote:
>> On 03/13/2013 05:09 AM, Michael Allan wrote:
>>> If the experts in the Election Methods list can't find a serious fault
>>> with this method, then it might be possible to bring down the party
>>> system in as little as a few years. Mind you, it would be no bad
>>> thing if it took a while longer, given the disruption it might cause.
>> Regarding liquid democracy methods in general, I think the vote-buying
>> problem is pretty serious. Or rather, that's not the worst part of it,
>> but it's a symptom of a more general aspect.
> Kristofer is asseting as a serious problem something on which there is
> zero experience. It's not clear that "vote-buying" is *ever* a serious
> problem.[...]

Vote-buying would become quite serious if "liquid democracy" (direct 
voting on issues) were adopted.

Many years ago I lived in a neighborhood that the police often had to 
visit, and I saw that the illegal behavior that the police responded to 
was just the tip of the iceberg.  Just making vote-buying and 
vote-selling illegal would not stop low-income people from selling their 
vote.  An underground ("black") market would develop.  Trying to stop it 
would have the same non-success as trying to stop the use of illegal drugs.

Also consider that the reason elections require people to appear in 
person to cast their votes is that it greatly reduces voter fraud, which 
is common without that requirement.  Of course there are exceptions. 
Here in Oregon everyone votes by mail, but that approach would not work 
in most other states because they are noticeably more corrupt.

Richard Fobes

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