[EM] [Politik] Helping the Pirate Party to vanish

[Michael Allan]

fisch01 said:
> I appreciate your visions. I think we all share the same here. :) To
> my mind the idea as a whole has to be spread and understood before a
> toolset yet to be developed and put together can be used to avoid
> the usual pitfalls. ...  But anyway all this should not keep us away
> from prototyping a whole new system.

Thank you.  I agree we need to be cautious.  We can only understand a
little of what we're trying to build, so we should build only a little
at a time.  We should proceed in small steps, and with prototypes.

I was slow in replying because I wanted to document a sound practice
first.  Unfortunately we cannot say to the electors (as I'd hoped),
"Vote for an open party and the same candidates are elected
regardless!  the parties are vanishing!"  The German election act
doesn't allow for multiple party nomination, after all.  So the
practice needed some slight changes: (and maybe this is better anyway)
http://zelea.com/w/Stuff:Votorola/p/assembly_election/multi-winner#In_Germany

The furthest the Pirate Party could go on its present course is to
replace the SPD.  It would then become like party H here:
http://lists.electorama.com/pipermail/election-methods-electorama.com/2013-April/031770.html

But if that argument is correct, the Pirates would then be eaten up by
the open parties (i1).  To avoid that fate, the party would have to
become an open party itself.  It would have to offer nominations to
all candidates (left and right) based purely on the results of cross-
-party, open primaries.  The election act doesn't allow candidates to
be *copied* across parties, but it does allow them to *move* across
parties (of course).  So I think this is one of the practices we need
to prototype and learn about.

Mike


fisch01 said:
> 
> I appreciate your visions. I think we all share the same here. :)
> To my mind the idea as a whole has to be spread and understood before a 
> toolset yet to be developed and put together can be used to avoid the 
> usual pitfalls. If people understand the idea they will be able to use the 
> tools. Maybe they will even use the current tools in some more efficent 
> ways to put pressure on politics. Else the tools could be target for abuse.
> The problem again is the established system. If we have no in germany 
> called "Fraktionszwang" for members of a party in a parlament no matter of 
> what instance and where things might begin the analogue way.
> In fact many even pp members just now refuse the use of LQFB because there 
> is no trust in digital systems[¹] 
> http://liquidfeedback.org/2013/04/17/liquid-democracy-ist-keine-alternative-zur-parlamentarischen-republik/[²] 
> http://ccc.de/de/updates/2008/brandenburg-beobachterbericht regarding that 
> purpose (although many use fb on a daily basis. So in fact it would be 
> easier for now that people really understand get explained the dimension 
> of how they use their now digitalized social networks in some new ways 
> they weren't able to use before).
> As we begin to use our tools in a small context just to avoid the usual 
> issues regarding time and geographical context things might change. As of 
> now I did not know how to proper explain even a political interested 
> person the use of LQFB other than as a new experiment in making political 
> decisions.
> But anyway all this should not keep us away from prototyping a whole new 
> system.
> [1] 
> http://liquidfeedback.org/2013/04/17/liquid-democracy-ist-keine-alternative-zur-parlamentarischen-republik/http://liquidfeedback.org/2013/04/17/liquid-democracy-ist-keine-alternative-zur-parlamentarischen-republik/
> [2]http://ccc.de/de/updates/2008/brandenburg-beobachterbericht 
> http://ccc.de/de/updates/2008/brandenburg-beobachterbericht
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