[EM] language/framing quibble

[Juho Laatu]

--- On Thu, 26/2/09, Kristofer Munsterhjelm <km-elmet at broadpark.no> wrote:

> Juho Laatu wrote:
> > --- On Tue, 17/2/09, Fred Gohlke
> <fredgohlke at verizon.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Whether or not the US is a democracy is a semantic
> >> question.
> > 
> > I use this term roughly so that a country
> > is democratic if people are able to make
> > change x if they are determined to make
> > x happen. There should be no fear of coup,
> > revenge, police or other serious personal
> > problems. This is the lower limit, not a
> > definition of a perfect democratic system.
> 
> This is somewhat offtopic, but consider a country where you
> have a ruler who makes decisions in a dictatorial manner,
> but where those decisions can be opposed by a supermajority.
> Would such a country be democratic? The supermajority of the
> people could make x happen (or at least make not-x not
> happen), yet their influence is very slight.

I wouldn't classify this country as
a democracy since being able to veto
the decisions is only half or less
than half of the requirement. The
citizens should decide what to do,
not just approve the proposals.

The supermajority requirement could
still fit in if it was reasonable.

> 
> Perhaps democracy is a scale, not a point, with direct
> democracy on one end and "elected kings" on the
> other? An elected king would be one who rules with absolute
> power for as long as he lives (unless he resigns), except
> that when the old king resigns or dies, there's an
> election for the new king.

This system almost falls within the
definition of democracy that I gave.
In the definition I said that
"people are able to make change x".
In this case that change would not
be possible if the king lives longer
than his subjects. Maybe the
definition should be read to say
also "within reasonable time".

Some real life examples for comparison.
- A strong president (strong enough to
  form the government) with sufficient
  support in the parliament etc. is
  close to an elected king for n years.
- In Europe there have been some
  successive votes on joining EU or
  on accepting the constitution of
  EU. This has been close to allowing
  the citizens to veto the wishes of
  the rulers n times until the wishes
  of the rulers will be implemented.

Juho